In this interview, award-winning sales influencer Cynthia Barnes shares her solid tips and strategies for asking for raises, referrals, and feedback, as well as her insights on why claiming your self-worth is like putting money in the bank. Though her professional focus is women-centric, the wisdom and advice she offers here is not only genderless but applicable in many ways to people outside of sales.

Cynthia is founder and CEO of the National Association of Women Sales Professionals (NAWSP) and Barnes Sales Institute. She has spent the past two decades studying the innate strengths of women in sales and what it takes for them to reach the top 1%. She is the creator of THRIVE: Success Strategies for Women in Sales, the first and only women-centric sales training (delivered to more than 500 companies, including Toyota, Google, and Michelin), author of Reach the Top 1%: A Strategic Game Plan for Warrior Women in Sales, and host of the podcast Unstoppable, with Cynthia Barnes.

Paul Quinn: Cynthia, in the book I’m writing about the importance of asking, there’s a section that explores the connection between self-worth and the willingness to ask for what we want. What’s your take on that connection? 

Cynthia Barnes: I learned a long time ago that our self-worth is directly related to what we expect in life. If I think that I am a worthy person, then I expect the worth that I give to others. If I love myself then I expect that love to be returned. There’s no reason why I wouldn’t expect that life wouldn’t give me in turn what I’m putting out. 

If my self-concept is low, then my initial thought is I come from a victim mentality and I’m pulling out all of this and not getting any return. The higher our self-concept is—and it’s different from self-esteem—it says I’m capable, I’m competent, and why shouldn’t I be deserving of all the good things in life?

Paul Quinn: And there’s a difference between recognizing the truth of that intellectually and actually feeling it, knowing it, and living it. How does a person come into their own self-worth?

Cynthia Barnes: It depends on the level of work you have to do. We all have self-limiting beliefs. And from a scientific standpoint there are neuropathways in our brains and we have to create new neural pathways to counteract the old ones. I won’t get into the science of it because I am not a scientist. But from someone who struggled with and was challenged by seeing her own self-worth, it is a conscious decision to be intentional about seeing the best in yourself. 

We all have choice, right? We all have options. I can choose to listen to my inner critic, or I can make an intentional choice to work through it or overcome it. And the moment you make that decision the universe conspires to help you.

Paul Quinn: You mentioned your previous struggles with self-worth. Do you have any personal stories you could share about that? 

Cynthia Barnes: Yes. When I first started coaching and consulting business owners on how to amplify their message, I went to a coach and he said, “If you’re going to be a coach you need to multiple your prices by about 10.” 

I said, “What? There’s no way anybody’s going to pay that!” 

The mere thought of me 10x’ing my price made my stomach clench, my palms sweat, and I broke out into a nice sheen—the glazed donut look on my forehead! But I did it anyway. I went to my would-be client and set out the deliverables and said this is how much the investment is going to be per month, minimum six-month agreement. And I stopped talking. And I stopped breathing. And they said give us a moment we’re going to think about it. So, I walked out, shut the door, and almost hyperventilated. 

Paul Quinn: Tense moment!

Cynthia Barnes: And they came back out and said, “We’re ready for you.” I went back in the room prepared for them to say, “That’s really expensive and we’re not paying that.” 

And they said, “Ok.” 

From that moment on it was no problem asking for that. But I had to do it that first time in order to believe that, yes, people will pay that and, yes, they think I‘m worth that. I had asked almost as a façade because I really didn’t believe people would pay it. But, as Amy Cuddy says, we should fake it until we become it.

Paul Quinn: That’s a more empowering take on “Fake it ‘til you make it!” Cynthia, a lot of mistakes get made and opportunities lost because people are afraid to ask questions. They fear they’ll sound stupid or incompetent for not knowing the answer. How does that play out in sales?

Cynthia Barnes: There’s a direct correlation between competence and confidence. When I know the inside and outside and upside down of what my ideal prospect wants, I can say that I probably know as much as they do other than the experience part. If I‘ve done my homework— and I’m not talking about the sales training that the company does—I’m reading the same journals, the same publications, reading the same blogs and watching the same TV shows as my ideal prospect. I’m lurking in their LinkedIn group and looking at all the questions that are going on. I’m now competent or more competent than I was not having done it.

And if they ask me something I don’t have the answer to, I am then more confident to be transparent and say, “You know what? I don’t know the answer to your question, but I can find out. Is that ok with you, Mr. Prospect?” And they will respect the heck out of you for that. 

Paul Quinn: What are your thoughts about asking for feedback? That’s not something everybody likes to do. 

Cynthia Barnes: Feedback is a gift. When someone shares feedback, whether you agree with it or not, they’re taking the time to voice their opinion about the experience they shared with you. You can learn from it and use it to make you better, or you can use it to make you bitter. Either way it’s a gift. I would hope you would it to make yourself better. 

Paul Quinn: How do you ask for feedback? What works for you?

Cynthia Barnes: I recently started asking my clients to fill out a Delight Form after every single coaching call. I can’t get better without their feedback. I can’t be a better coach to them without their feedback. So, one of the ways for us to show up as our best selves is to elicit the feedback of other people. What can I do to improve? And you don’t want those people to say, Oh, you’re fine. No. You’re looking for the constructive feedback.

Paul Quinn: How do you transition from asking for feedback to asking for referrals?

Cynthia Barnes: I have a referral link in my coaching, but you have to make sure you’re delighting your customers first. You can’t ask for a referral if they’re dissatisfied. So, after that first interaction you want to follow up with two days, two weeks, and two months. That’s the magic formula. So, two days after the product is delivered, I ask, “How’s it going? What about the experience of buying do we or I do well?  For the next time, what can I improve on?”

Two weeks after that: “So, you’ve had a chance to use the service. What do you like about it? If you could change anything, if I brought you in to our product development team, what would you change?” And they might say what that would be. [Then I would say] “Thank you so much. I wrote those things down and I’m to take it back to our team to see what we can do about that.”

Two months in: “How are things going? What do you like, what can we improve on?” Never what you dislike, but what can we improve on? 

Paul Quinn: What are their reactions to being asked for feedback so intently? 

Cynthia Barnes: They’re shocked, because I actually pick up the phone and call and ask. Because I care. I don’t send a survey. I want to know. So, because we have that relationship it makes them feel comfortable enough to say, “You know, Cynthia, I really like this and this, and wish we could do [something else] differently.” I want that feedback.

Paul Quinn: Even if you didn’t have that relationship with the customer before that point, I suppose that asking for their feedback with such a sense of purpose could really develop the relationship. 

Cynthia Barnes: Absolutely.

Paul Quinn: How do you transition from asking their feedback to asking for referrals?

Cynthia Barnes: Once I know they’re satisfied, I ask, “Who do you know”—not, “Do you know anybody?” because that’s a yes or no question—but, “Who do you know who would enjoy the deliverables or the level of satisfaction that our product or service delivers?”

Paul Quinn: And if they say they can’t think of anybody …?

Cynthia Barnes: Then I say, “How about you look through the last ten people that you texted or emailed, and let me know?”

Paul Quinn: How do customers react?

Cynthia Barnes: They laugh!

Paul Quinn: I imagine it would take them by surprise! A lot has been written about the reluctance of many women to ask for what they want. As a woman and founder and CEO of NAWSP, what is your view on women and asking?

Cynthia Barnes: We don’t ask enough. Women have a fear of rejection and of not seeing themselves as worthy of receiving.

Paul Quinn: As a mentor, do you find yourself challenging women’s perceptions of what they can ask for?

Cynthia Barnes: Yes, just today I put up a post on LinkedIn about, What would you accomplish if you were twice as confident and twice as strong? Would you ask for the raise? The promotion? Would you start a business? What are you not asking for because you’re afraid—either afraid that you’ll get it or afraid that you won’t?

Paul Quinn: Those questions cut right to the chase. You posed another challenging question in a podcast I watched: “If time and ability were not factors, what would you have, what would you be, and what would you do?” So much to look at in a question like that. No quick answer, either—it demands a whole-self response, doesn’t it? 

Cynthia Barnes: Absolutely.

Paul Quinn: What is your advice about asking for raises? 

Cynthia Barnes: Ask for transparency. What is everyone on the team making? Do your homework to find that out. Then reach down into the depths of your soul and say to your boss, I know that equity is important to our company based upon this this and this. And I want to ensure that I am making as much money as my male counterparts. Can you make sure of that? Can we work on this together?

Paul Quinn: Have you ever asked that of a boss yourself?

Cynthia Barnes: No, I walked in for my annual review and was full of bravado. I was looking for a job, so I was not afraid to get fired. They said how much raise do you think you should have, and I said I think you should pay me what you pay my male counterparts.

Paul Quinn: It’s sad that that needs to be explicitly stated. 

Cynthia Barnes: Exactly! And they said, “Well what do you mean?” And I said you know what I mean.

Paul Quinn: What was the result?

Cynthia Barnes: Instant pay raise. Because they can’t provide lip service on their blog about equity and equality and women and then not pay everyone the same. That’s not a can of worms you want to open with me. And more women are getting comfortable demanding pay equity instead of 79 and 80 cents on the dollar.

Paul Quinn: You mentioned doing homework to find how much co-workers are making. How do you do that?

Cynthia Barnes: You ask!

Paul Quinn: Don‘t a lot of people guard that information? 

Cynthia Barnes: Yeah. Not everybody will say yes.

Paul Quinn: And so, ask anyway, right?

Cynthia Barnes: Exactly!

Paul Quinn: Everything we’ve been talking about here—self-worth, asking for feedback, referrals, raises—seems to come down to confidence.

Cynthia Barnes: Yes! Confidence is transferable. It is infectious. So, when you show up as your best true self—confident, competent, self-assured, knowing without a shadow of a doubt that you are the right person to professionally solve your prospect’s problems, or ask for what you want—it comes across. People are attracted to confidence, either because they see it in themselves or want it in themselves. But confidence is the ultimate aphrodisiac.

Paul Quinn is author of a nearly completed book about asking as a life skill, which features portions of this content.